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Simon Altaf with Howard Conder on Revelation TV

Its a package take it and be
guaranteed eternity with Him or remain outside
to suffer eternally.
Choice
is clear,
either
you have the Son or you
have nothing!
For they have consulted together with one consent: they are confederate against thee:
Psalm 83:5
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As a concerned Christian, I would
like to fervently respond to
the following paper which was delivered
at the CAPS Convention in Virginia
Beach, Virginia entitled:
THE USE OF THE
MYERS/BRIGGS
INSTRUMENT IN
SANCTIFICATION
OF LIFE AND MARRIAGE
RELATIONSHIPS
John H. Stoll, Ph.D.
Executive Director, ASK,
Inc.
Dr. Stoll proposes
that your marriage can
be sanctified by the
Meyers-Briggs test even
though the Bible states
precisely that we are
sanctified by the Word
of God. Ironically, he
uses the very Scripture
to support using
Myers-Briggs which
should be used to refute
its use. If the Word
sanctifies and perfects
us,
"He might sanctify and
cleanse it with the
washing of water by the
Word" (Ephesians
5:21-26) then what can
Carl Jung/Myers-Briggs
add? He also states
that Christians should
be treated equally, but
most Christians were
never administered the
Myers-Briggs test either
today or before it
existed, so how is that
equal treatment ("There
should be no schism in
the body; but that the
members should have the
same care, one for
another" (I Cor.
12:25). Now, the only
difference I can see
between MBTI & Carl Jung
himself, is that MBTI
uses numerology to
codify and number the
results of the
personality profiling.
To sanctify means in
part to make holy. How
do you make something
holy with something
which is unholy?
For your convenience and
reference, Dr. John
Stoll's paper which he
presented at your
convention may be
located at:
As you all know,
Myers-Briggs is based on
the theories of Carl
Jung. So, I invite you
to test the spirits to
see if they be of God
and re-examine whether
or not his ideas are
truly Biblical and
whether or not a
Christian Counselor or
Pastor can truly
implement these tests.
I will prove to you
below from Jung's own
words that his
personality profiling
was derived from a
demonic spirit-guide
named Philemon.
The Bible calls this
Divination and is
forbidden by the Lord.
In addition
to my article below,
I encourage you the
read the following
two scholarly
articles on the Paganization
of Christianity.
I invite you to
consider the
following documents
which prove the
Clear and Present
Danger of Carl Jung
and Psychology
which has already
become the Trojan
Horse and Strange
Fire within the Body
of Christ and has
become a central
theme to the Church
Growth Movement
through Bill Hybels
at Willowcreek and
Rick Warren via his
Purpose Driven
Church.
I appeal to you
all to consider
two Scriptures
with respect to
the use of
Meyers-Briggs
and Personality
Profiling in
counseling:
"Let now the
astrologers, the
stargazers, the
monthly
prognosticators
stand up, and
save thee from
these things
that shall come
"Behold, they
shall be as
stubble;..."
Isaiah 47:13.
"Ye shall know
them by their
fruits. Do men
gather grapes of
thorns, or figs
of thistles?"
Matthew 7:16
"For a good tree
bringeth not
forth corrupt
fruit;
neither doth a
corrupt tree
bring forth good
fruit.
For every tree
is known by his
own fruit. For
of thorns men
do not gather
figs, nor of
a bramble bush
gather they
grapes." Luke
6:43-44 "Can
the fig tree, my
brethren, bear
olive berries?
either a vine,
figs? so
[can] no
fountain both
yield salt water
and fresh."
James 3:12
"Ye cannot drink
the cup of the
Lord, and
the cup of
devils: ye
cannot be
partakers of the
Lord's table,
and of the
table of
devils." I
Corinthians
10:21
"Blessed [is]
the man that
walketh
not in
the
counsel of
the
ungodly, nor
standeth in the
way of sinners,
nor sitteth in
the seat of the
scornful." Psalm
1:1 (Carl Jung
was clearly
ungodly and
unbiblical in
his ideas)
Finally, I
humbly submit to
you the
following verse
in the hope that
I might actually
recruit you to
become part of a
vanguard to your
colleagues,
members, and
those you
counsel to fear
the Lord in
considering this
Scripture:
"Whoever causes
one of these
little ones to
stumble, it
would be better
for him to have
a heavy
millstone hung
around his neck,
and to be
drowned in the
depth of the
sea.” Matthew
18:6
Thank you for
your time and
consideration.
Kindest regards
in Christ,
James Sundquist
President
Rock Salt
Publishing
CHURCH GROWTH
MOVEMENT
INFLUENCE OF
CARL JUNG ON THE
CHURCH, PART III
By James
Sundquist
with Subsequent
Excerpts from
Pastor Gary
Gilley’s work
and an Article
by Rev. Ed Hirt
I sent the
following letter
to a relative
who is working
on his Masters
Degree in
Psychology to
alert him to the
dangers of
Psychological
Profiling in the
Church.
The
Meyers-Brigg’s
derivative the
Keirsey-Bates
Temperament
Sorter is being
used extensively
by Rick Warren
in his SHAPE
Program. Bill
Hybels the
Director of the
Willowcreek
Association,
promotes the
Meyers-Briggs
test itself in
more than 7,500
churches and 90
countries who
endorses the
Meyers-Briggs
test for his
members and
attenders.
Now one of
the most
important
Scriptures that
bear on this
subject is:
"Now the
Spirit speaketh
expressly, that
in the latter
times some shall
depart from the
faith, giving
heed to seducing
spirits, and
doctrines of
devils." I
Timothy 4:1*
This verse is
significant in
two respects:
1. It
demonstrates
that devils
(evil spirits)
are not only
real but
that they are
not archaic in
that they not
only once
existed, but now
are NOT extinct.
They do indeed
exist today.
*A word of
clarification
and commentary
on this passage.
Paul gives two
examples of what
he is referring
to in I Timothy
4:3 (two verses
later) which
were already
being practiced
in Paul’s
lifetime. The
two doctrines of
demons of
forbidding to
Marry and
abstaining from
meat would
eventually
become pillars
in Roman
Catholicism:
"Forbidding
to marry,
[and commanding]
to abstain
from meats,
which God hath
created to be
received with
thanksgiving of
them which
believe and know
the truth." I
Timothy 4:3
But the fact
is all false
teaching comes
from the Father
of Lies and his
legions who have
perpetuated them
from Creation.
So it is not
only forbidding
to marry and
commanding the
abstain from
meat that would
constitute
doctrines of
demons and
seducing
spirits, but any
false teaching
would also
qualify,
including the
Meyers-Briggs
Personality
Profiling which
was conceived
from Carl Jung
practicing
Divination
through a
spirit-guide
named Philemon.
The existence
of evil spirits
is further
confirmed by the
Apostle Paul’s
words:
"For we
wrestle not
against flesh
and blood, but
against
principalities,
against powers,
against the
rulers of the
darkness of this
world, against
spiritual
wickedness in
high [places]."
Ephesians 6:12
&
"Wherein in
time past ye
walked according
to the course of
this world,
according to the
prince of the
power of the
air, the spirit
that now worketh
in the children
of
disobedience:"
Ephesians 2:2
2. If
Christians will
depart from the
faith in the
Great Falling
Away for giving
heed to these
spirits and
teachings, don’t
you think it is
important for us
to know what a
false teaching
would look like,
for Paul to warn
us?
Now I will
admit, it is not
always easy to
tell if a
teaching is
false without
the Spiritual
Gift of
Discernment
and/or without
knowing the
Bible well. But
some things are
very easy to
detect. We
simply look in
the Scriptures
to see if God
forbids it or
condemns a
practice or
teaching.
This brings me
to Carl Jung.
His theory of
Personality is
at the core of
the
Meyers-Briggs
Test as well as
the Keirsey-Bates
Temperament
Sorter.
This can be
verified by
simply going to
either of their
websites.
Keirsey
Temperament
Sorter is also
used and
promoted by Gary
Smalley. You can
go to his
website to
confirm this. I
have contacted
the Jung
Institute in
Switzerland
where Carl Jung
founded his work
and the Jung
Institute in
Dallas, TX.
I also have been
in email
correspondence
with David
Keirsey, Jr. His
father designed
the Keirsey-Bates
Temperament
Sorter. He
confirms that
his father was
somewhere
between an
agnostic and
atheist and
believed in
Darwin’s
Evolution as
well as Jung, of
course. I asked
the Jung
Institute point
blank for the
statements made
by Carl Jung
himself that
confirms he
believed in
Darwin’s
evolution and
that Carl Jung
believed that
our temperaments
originated in
pre-human animal
ancestry.
Where did he get
these ideas?
Well from his
own admission,
from a
spirit-guide
named Philemon.
Jung states:
"Philemon and
other figures of
my fantasies
brought home to
me the crucial
insight that
there are things
in the psyche
which I do not
produce, but
which produce
themselves and
have their own
life. Philemon
represented a
force which was
not myself. In
my fantasies I
held
conversations
with him, and he
said things
which I had not
consciously
thought. For I
observed clearly
that it was he
who spoke, not
I. . . .
Psychologically,
Philemon
represented
superior
insight. He was
a mysterious
figure to me. At
times he seemed
to me quite
real, as if he
were a living
personality. I
went walking up
and down the
garden with him,
and to me he was
what the Indians
call a guru."
Jung, Memories,
Dreams,
Reflections, op.
cit., p. 183.
He also drew
it from Greek
paganism and
mythology. Does
this sound good
to you? Well the
Bible calls this
Divination.
Here are some
other answers I
got back re Jung
(with my
questions)
> Dear Mental
Health Professor
of Continuing
Education,
>
> > Do you
happen to have
or know where I
could secure a
quote or
citation that
Carl Jung
believed our
collective
subconscious
came from
pre-human or
animal ancestry
(evolution)?
>
> Thanks
> James
James,
Here is a
quotation from A
Primer of
Jungian
Psychology by
Calvin S. Hall
and Vernon J.
Nordby,
Meridian, 1999,
p. 39. This is
from a section
about The
Collective
Unconscious.
"The mind of man
is prefigured by
evolution. Thus,
the individual
is linked with
his past, not
only with the
past of his
infancy but more
importantly with
the past of the
species and
before that with
the long stretch
of organic
evolution. This
placing of the
psyche within
the evolutionary
process was
Jung's
preeminent
achievement."
Dear James at
Rock Salt
Publishing,
In answer to
your search for
a quote, may I
refer you to
Vol. 20, the
Index, of Jung’s
Collected Works.
Best Regards,
Ellie
Stillman
Ellie
Stillman,
Library &
Bookstore
C.G.Jung
Institute
Hornweg 28
8700
Küsnacht,
SWITZERLAND
Check out a
small book by
Calvin S. Hall
and Vernon J.
Nordby called "A
Primer of
Jungian
Psychology." On
page 38-41
you'll find a
discussion of
the Collective
Unconscious that
explains Jung's
position on the
connection to
"primordial
images" as he
referred to the
reservoir of
latent images in
the
collective
unconscious.
I'll give
you a small
quote from the
Hall/Nordby
book:
"Man inherits
these images
from his
ancestral past,
a past that
includes all of
his human
ancestors as
well as his
prehuman or
animal
ancestors. These
racial images
are not
inherited in the
sense that a
person
consciously
remembers or has
images that his
ancestors had.
Rather they are
predispositions
or
potentialities
for experiencing
and responding
to the world in
the same ways
that his
ancestors
did."p. 39
"The evolution
of a collective
unconscious can
be accounted for
in the same way
that the
evolution of the
body is
explained.
Because the
brain is the
principal organ
of the mind, the
collective
unconscious
depends directly
upon the
evolution of the
brain." p. 40
Try Vol 7 of
the Collected
Works of C. G.
Jung, the
chapter on the
'Archetypes of
the collective
unconscious'.
Yours
sincerely,
Pramila
Bennett
Administrative
Editor
Journal of
Analytical
Psychology
tel. 020 7794
3640
To:
j.ap@talk21.com
Sent:
Monday, January
20, 2003 1:23 PM
Subject:
Question about
Carl Jung Quotes
Dear JAP
Editor(s),
Do you happen
to have or know
where I could
secure a quote
or citation that
Carl Jung
believed our
collective
subconscious
came from
pre-human or
animal ancestry
(evolution)?
Thanks
James
*******
Why can’t we
import the
philosophies of
this age and
integrate them
into the Church
to help it grow?
Isn’t that
what Bill Hybels
and Rick Warren
are doing?
What’s wrong
with that?
Most of the
truly great
God-fearing
Biblical
scholars were
not wrestling
over issues
because they
thought the
Bible was
insufficient,
but because they
believed the
Bible was
sufficient, but
knew that
answers were
still within the
Scriptures,
not outside
of Scripture.
If you read all
of the accounts
of Paul’s
journeys, Paul
always reasoned
from Scripture.
Why did he do
that? He knew
they did supply
the answers to
life and eternal
life. What issue
would not have
the answer in
the Bible? What
would you use to
determine the
absolute
authority of
answers supplied
in books outside
of the Bible?
And even if you
could trust an
authority
outside of the
Bible, why would
you want to seek
counsel from the
philosophers of
this age who
practiced
Divination to
get their
answers, as Bill
Hybels, Rick
Warren, and
Melody Beattie
have all done by
importing the
ideas and false
teachings of
people such as
Carl Jung?
(Melody Beattie,
who promotes
Eastern
Meditation, is
referenced more
times than any
other author in
Bill Hybels'
book, "Fit To be
Tied," and her
books are sold
at Willow
Creek.)
See also:
http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/exposes/hybels/general.htm:
"- As
indicated above,
the Hybels have
read a great
number of
counseling and
psychological
books and have
attended many
seminars (Fit
To Be Tied,
pp. 210-211).
Fit To Be Tied
also gives
ample evidence
that they have
been strongly
influenced by
the
psychological
writings of
Melody Beattie.
Beattie is
footnoted more
than any other
person in Fit
To Be Tied.
For example, in
chapter 12 there
are eight
footnotes
referring
authoritatively
to Beattie and
her book
Codependent No
More. On p.
196, the whole
page is devoted
to Beattie's
theories, with
five footnote
references to
Beattie's
Codependent No
More. The
reader is given
the clear
impression that
Beattie is an
expert and is to
be trusted.
There is no
indication by
the Hybels who
Beattie really
is and what she
teaches. (Melody
Beattie's books
are also sold in
Hybels' church
bookstore.)
Who is this
woman that the
Hybels respect
as an "author
and counselor"?
What does she
teach in
Codependent No
More and in
her two sequels,
Beyond
Codependency
and
Codependent
Guide to the
Twelve Steps?
Beattie's
books from
cover to
cover are hard
core humanistic
psychology.
But they are
more than that.
Codependent
No More is
also a strong
promotion and
endorsement of
Alcoholics
Anonymous/12-step
programs.
Beattie strongly
advocates and
teaches her
readers to seek
a "Higher
Power," any
"Higher Power."
This Higher
Power is not the
God of the
Bible, but is
whatever one
conceives in his
imagination.
This is idolatry
in its purest
form. (A
female "elder"
at Willow Creek
claims "our
higher power
here [at
Willow Creek] is
Christ.")
[Beattie also
endorses and
highly
recommends
reading A
Course In
Miracles,
which is full of
hard core New
Age teaching
and was dictated
by a spirit
guide (i.e., a
demon) to its
author. It is
published by the
New Age
organization
Foundation for
Inner Peace.
Beattie also
endorses the
best selling New
Age book in the
U.S. -- The
Road Less
Traveled by
M. Scott Peck.
(Like Melodie
Beattie, Hybels
likes M. Scott
Peck enough to
speak favorably
of him a
number of times
in his books and
in various
articles. Hybels
never gives one
word of warning
whatsoever
about this
New Age guru.)]"
You should
rightfully
demand proof
that Melody
Beattie promotes
unbiblical
mediation at
Willowcreek, so
here is the
evidence:
"About Step
11 in the Twelve
Step Program
Melody Beattie
states: "STEP
#11: "Sought
through prayer
and meditation
to improve our
conscious
contact with God
as we
understood
Him, praying
only for
knowledge of His
will for us and
the power to
carry that out"
(emphasis in
original). The
question must be
asked, "If these
people are not
praying to the
true God, what
kind of
responses are
they receiving,
and from whom?"
Beattie,
whose books are
regularly sold
in Christian
bookstores, has
this to say,
"Now I have
found a
spiritual path
through some
Native American
practices. Zen
meditation, and
shamanistic
practices. . .
We build a
connection to
God by building
a connection to
ourselves "
(p179,180).
She also has
this to say
about the
messages we
receive from
"our god," "When
it is time, we
will receive all
the guidance,
power and
assistance we
need to do what
we have to do,
and we can let
go of the rest.
If we wait until
it is time, our
part will be
clear. It will
be possible. It
will happen —
naturally,
gradually, and
with ease. . .
When in doubt,
when confused
stop and ask:
What do I need
to do to take
care of myself?
Then listen, and
trust what we
hear" (p184).
SCARY STUFF!""
(Source Gary
Gilley, Pastor,
Southern View
Chapel,
Springfield, IL,
http://www.svchapel.org/ThinkOnTheseThingsMinistries/publications/html/12step.html)
You should
rightfully
demand proof
that Bill Hybels
promotes
Carl Jung based
Meyers-Briggs
test:
Hybels
states:
"Do you and
your spouse need
to patiently
understand each
other's ways of
behaving that
stem from
different inborn
temperament
traits? Then do
it! Or better
yet, find a
counselor who
can give you the
Myers-Briggs
test, and
help you work
through the
results. It's an
investment that
could
revolutionize
the most
important
relationship in
your life."
Source: Bill
Hybels, "Honest
to God," (pp.
74-75),
What book
would you
suggest we use
to, in fact,
determine what
would constitute
"doctrines of
demons and
seducing
spirits" that
Paul warned us
about that the
Church would
give heed to?
Now you might
protest to say
"we don’t
believe in
Divination and
we certainly
don’t practice
it." Or you
might say "Well
it is certainly
obvious to me
now, after you
pointed it out
that truly
Personality
Profiling was
conceived out of
Divination. But
it’s OK to use
it, because we
ourselves did
not use
divination to
come up with
this personality
theory in the
first place. We
just use it.
Afterall,
doesn’t the
Bible say the
wealth of the
wicked is stored
up for the
righteous?" Or,
"we aren’t
taking the test
derived from
divination, just
using the
results of the
test conceived
by Carl Jung."
Yes you are if
you take the
test. Carl Jung
simply included
the instructions
for this deadly
game. The
argument: "we
are not
practicing
divination when
we take this
profile" is
simply not true.
As soon as you
start
identifying and
believing the
archetype traits
that Carl Jung
devised, you are
practicing
divination. You
are using it to
discover hidden
inner knowledge.
You are using it
to plan your
life and direct
your course in
the Church,
exactly what
astrology does.
"I don’t
practice
divination, I
just live by the
results of using
divination to
conduct my
life." Are you
kidding? And now
they have MBTI’s
for children.
You don’t think
the Scripture
about stumbling
the least one of
these my
children will
apply to you?
You don’t think
teachers who are
held to a
stricter
accounting will
not be held
accountable for
feeding God’s
sheep these
personality
profiles?
*******
The following
is A
report by Rev.
Ed Hird, Past
National Chair
of ARM Canada,
with all of the
citations and
proof that Carl
Jung held these
views (it is
superb):
http://www3.bc.sympatico.ca/st_simons/arm03.htm
So is this
something a
Christian should
believe in or
dabble in, let
alone import it
as a program for
the entire
church? So this
is proof that a
person or
Christian who
takes these
Personality
Profiling tests
is
simultaneously
doing all of the
following at the
same time:
DIVINATION
NUMEROLOGY
ASTROLOGY
(Yes, Jung used
this too... read
his lectures)
EVOLUTION
NECROMANCY
(Jung thought he
could talk to
the dead, and
the dead could
talk back) (Carl
Jung, Memories,
Dreams,
Reflections, p.
18, 70-199).
"Blessed [is]
the man that
walketh not in
the counsel of
the ungodly,
nor standeth in
the way of
sinners, nor
sitteth in the
seat of the
scornful." Psalm
1:1
"Ye cannot
drink the cup of
the Lord, and
the cup of
devils: ye
cannot be
partakers of the
Lord's table,
and of the table
of devils." I
Corinthians
10:21
Carl Jung was
ungodly and he
did not fear the
Lord, which is
the beginning of
Wisdom....so he
did not even
have a
beginning. And
as Isaiah says
"To the law and
to the
testimony: if
they speak not
according to
this word, [it
is] because
[there is] no
light in them."
Isaiah 8:20
So, doesn’t NO
LIGHT mean NO
LIGHT?
So, as kindly
as I can tell
you this exactly
what Paul the
Apostle meant by
Doctrine of
Demons and
Seducing
Spirits. It is
hard to imagine
him warning us
about something
non-existent
isn’t it?
For more
information on
this subject I
recommend the
book
ADDICTED TO
RECOVERY
by Dr. Gary Almy,
M.D., who is an
Associate
Professor of
Psychiatry at
Loyola
University
School of
Medicine in
Chicago and
Associate Chief
of Staff at
Edward Hines, Jr.,
Veteran’s
Hospital in
Hines, IL.
I also appeal
to you based on
the Apostle
Paul’s Letter to
Timothy:
"O Timothy,
keep that which
is committed to
thy trust,
avoiding profane
[and] vain
babblings, and
oppositions of
science falsely
so called: Which
some professing
have erred
concerning the
faith. Grace
[be] with thee.
Amen." I Timothy
6:20-21
My final
appeal to you is
in the words of
Jesus Christ
himself:
"Beware of
false prophets,
which come to
you in sheep's
clothing, but
inwardly they
are ravening
wolves. Ye shall
know them by
their fruits. Do
men gather
grapes of
thorns, or figs
of thistles?
Even so every
good tree
bringeth forth
good fruit; but
a corrupt tree
bringeth forth
evil fruit.
A good tree
cannot bring
forth evil
fruit, neither
[can] a corrupt
tree bring forth
good fruit.
Every tree
that bringeth
not forth good
fruit is hewn
down, and cast
into the fire."
Matthew
7:15-19
The goal of
our instruction
is love, so my
fervent hope is
that in the end
that this would
all be edifying
to you both, as
we would all be
lovers of the
truth!
Thank you for
taking the time
to read this!
But above
all, I commend
you to do what
Paul said of the
Bereans...study
the Scriptures
to see if these
things be true,
and study the
quotes of these
teachers and see
for yourselves
if their
teachings line
up with
Scripture....
*********************
Article on
the more
comprehensive
roots of
Personality
Typing:
Here is the
link:
http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/Psychology/temper.htm
**********************************
CARL JUNG,
NEO-GNOSTICISM,
& THE MBTI
A report by
Rev. Ed Hird,
Past National
Chair of ARM
Canada
(revised March
18/98)
In 1991, I
had the
wonderful
privilege of
attending the
Episcopal
Renewal
Ministries(ERM)
Leadership
Training
Institute (LTI)
in Evergreen,
Colorado. Since
then, I and
others
encouraged
Anglican Renewal
Ministries
Canada to
endorse the LTI
approach,
reporting in the
ARM Canada
magazine with
articles about
our helpful LTI
experiences. ARM
Canada, through
our LTI
Director, Rev.
Murray
Henderson, has
since run a
number of very
helpful Clergy
and Lay LTIs
across Canada,
which have been
well received
and appreciated.
Through
listening to the
tapes by Leanne
Payne and Dr.
Jeffrey
Satinover from
the 1995 Kelowna
Prayer
Conference, I
came across some
new data that
challenged me to
do some
rethinking about
the Jungian
nature of the
MBTI
(Myers-Briggs
Temperament
Indicator) used
in the current
ARM Canada LTIs.
Dr. Jeffrey
Satinover’s
critique of
Jungianism came
with unique
credibility,
given his
background as an
eminent Jungian
scholar,
analyst, and
past President
of the C.G. Jung
Foundation. I
began to do some
reading on Carl
Jung, and mailed
each ARM Board
member a copy of
the two audio
tapes by Payne
and Satinover.
The ARM Board at
our April 1996
meeting took an
initial look at
the Jungian
nature of the
MBTI, and
whether we
should continue
to use the MBTI
in our LTIs. Our
ARM Board agreed
to do some
investigating on
this topic and
report back with
some information
to discuss at
the November
1996 ARM Board
meeting.
Currently
approximately
two and a half
million people
are ‘initiated’
each year into
the MBTI
process. (1)
According to
Peter B. Myers,
it is now the
most extensively
used personality
instrument in
history. (2)
There is even a
MBTI version for
children, called
the MMTIC
(Murphy-Meisgeier
Type Indicator
for
Children)(3),
and a simplified
adult MBTI-like
tool for the
general public,
known as the
Keirsey-Bates
Indicator. A
most helpful
resource in
analyzing the
MBTI is the
English Grove
Booklet by Rev.
Robert Innes, of
St. John’s
College, Durham,
entitled
Personality
Indicators & the
Spiritual Life.
Innes focused on
"the two
indicators most
widely used by
Christian groups
- Myers-Briggs
and the
Enneagram."(4)
One of the key
questions for
the ARM Board to
settle is
whether the MBTI
is an integral
part of Jungian
neo-gnosticism,
or alternately,
that it may be a
detachable
benevolent
portion of
Jung’s
philosophy in an
otherwise
suspect context.
To use a visual
picture, is the
MBTI the
‘marijuana’, the
low-level entry
drug that
potentially
opens the door
to the more
hard-core
Jungian
involvement, or
is it just a
harmless sugar
tablet? To get
at this
question, I have
broken my
analysis down
into smaller,
more concrete
questions.
1. Is the
MBTI actually
connected with
Carl Jung?
The Rev. Canon
Charles Fulton,
President of ERM,
commented in a
June 17th, 1996
letter that "We
have certainly
had some
concerns over
the MBTI over
the years and
its Jungian
nature". Rev.
Fred Goodwin,
Rector of
National
Ministries for
ERM, commented
in a September
18th, 1996
letter that
"...we (ERM) no
longer use the
MBTI in our
teachings...we’ve
not included it
in the last
couple of years
- believing that
there are many
other models and
issues that need
to be discussed
with clergy and
lay leaders." In
Isabel
Briggs-Myers’
book
Introduction To
Type (1983), she
comments that
the MBTI is
"based on Jung’s
theory of
psychological
types."(5) In
the book People
Types and Tiger
Stripes written
by Jungian
practitioner Dr.
Gordon Lawrence,
he states that
"The (MBTI)
Indicator was
developed
specifically to
carry Carl
Jung’s theory of
type (Jung,
1921, 1971) into
practical
application."(6)
In the Grove
Book on
personality
indicators,
Robert Innes
comments that
"Carl Jung’s
psychology lies
behind...the
MBTI".(7)
The Buros
Mental
Measurement
YearBook (1989,
10th Edition)
notes that the
MBTI "...is a
construct-oriented
test that is
inextricably
linked with
Jung’s (1923)
theory of
psychological
types."(8) As to
the evidence of
validity, Buros
characterizes
the stability of
type
classification
over time as
"somewhat
disappointing."(9)
The Jungian/MBTI
stance, as
expressed by Dr.
Gordon Lawrence,
former President
of the
Association for
Psychological
Types, is that
MBTI "types are
a fact", not a
theory.(10)
After reviewing
the statistical
evidence
relating to the
MBTI, however,
Dr. Paul Kline,
Professor of
Psychometrics at
Exeter
University,
commented that
"There has been
no clear support
for the 8-fold
categorization,
despite the
popularity of
the MBTI."(11)
Mario Bergner, a
colleague of
Leanne Payne in
Pastoral Care
Ministries,
observed in a
July 2nd, 1996
letter that "of
all the
different types
of psychological
testing, forced
choice tests
(such as the
MBTI) are
considered the
least valid."
More
specifically,
Bergner noted
that "the
validity of the
MBTI is at zero
because the test
is based on a
Jungian
understanding of
the soul which
cannot be
measured for
good or bad."
The official
MBTI view, as
expressed by Dr.
Gordon Lawrence,
is that MBTI
personality
designations are
"as unchangeable
as the stripes
on a tiger".(12)
Bergner, in
contrast, does
not believe that
all of humanity
can be
unchangeably
boxed into 16
temperament
types, and is
concerned about
cases where
people are being
rejected for job
applications,
because they
don’t fit
certain MBTI
categories.
2. What is
Carl Jung’s
Relation to
Neo-Gnosticism?
Carl Jung is
described by
Merill Berger, a
Jungian
psychologist, as
"the
psychologist of
the 21st
century".(13)
Dr. Satinover
says "Because of
his great
influence in
propagating
gnostic
philosophy and
morals in
churches &
synagogues, Jung
deserves a
closer look. The
moral relativism
that released
upon us the
sexual
revolution is
rooted in an
outlook of which
(Jung) is the
most brilliant
contemporary
expositor."(14)
One could say
without
overstatement
that Carl Jung
is the Father of
Neo-Gnosticism &
the New Age
Movement.
That is why
Satinover
comments that
"One of the most
powerful modern
forms of
Gnosticism is
without question
Jungian
psychology, both
within or
without the
Church".(15)
Carl Jung
"explicitly
identified depth
psychology,
especially his
own, as heir to
the apostolic
tradition,
especially in
what he
considered its
superior
handling of the
problem of
evil."(16) Jung
claimed that "In
the ancient
world, the
Gnostics, whose
arguments were
very much
influenced by
psychic
experience,
tackled the
problem of evil
on a broader
basis than the
Church
Fathers."(17)
Dr. Satinover
notes that
"Whatever the
system, and
however the
different stages
are purportedly
marked, the
ultimate aim,
the innermost
circle of all
Gnostic systems,
is a mystical
vision of the
union of good
and evil."(18)
Jung, says
Satinover,
"devoted most of
his adult life
to a study of
alchemy; he also
explicated both
antique
hermeticism and
the ‘christian’
gnostics; his
earliest
writings were
about
spiritualism..."(19)
In his
autobiography
Memories,
Dreams,
Reflections,
Jung claimed:
"The possibility
of a comparison
with alchemy,
and the
uninterrupted
intellectual
chain back to
Gnosticism, gave
substance to my
psychology."(20)
Most people are
not aware that
Jung collected
one of the
largest amassing
of
spiritualistic
writings found
on the European
continent.(21)
Dr. James
Hillman, the
former director
for the Jungian
Institute in
Zurich,
commented,
"(Jung) wrote
the first
introduction to
Zen Buddhism,
he...brought in
(Greek
Mythology), the
gods and the
goddesses, the
myths,...he was
interested in
astrology..."(22)
In 1929, Jung
wrote a
commentary on
the Secret of
the Golden
Flower, which he
said was "not
only a Taoist
text concerned
with Chinese
Yoga, but is
also an
alchemical
treatise."(23)
He comments that
"...it was the
text of the
Golden Flower
that first put
me on the right
track. For in
medieval alchemy
we have the
long-sought
connecting link
between Gnosis
(i.e. of the
Gnostics) and
the processes of
the collective
unconscious that
can be observed
in modern
man..."(24)
Dr. Richard Noll
comments that
"the divinatory
methods of the I
Ching, used
often by Jung in
the 1920s and
1930s, were a
part of the
initial training
program of the
C.G. Jung
Institute of
Zurich in 1948,
and its use is
widely advocated
today in Jungian
Analytic-Training
Institutes
throughout the
world."(25)
During the
hippie movement
of the 1960’s,
the Rock Opera
Hair boldly
proclaimed the
alleged dawning
of the Age of
Aquarius. Once
again Carl
Jung
foreshadowed
this emphasis in
a 1940 letter to
his former
assistant,
Godwin Baynes:
"1940 is the
year when we
approach the
meridian of the
first star in
Aquarius.
It is the
premonitory
earthquake of
the New
Age."(26) In
Jung’s book Aion,
he holds that
"...the
appearance of
Christ coincided
with the
beginning of a
new aeon, the
age of the
Fishes. A
sychronicity
exists between
the life of
Christ and the
objective
astronomical
event, the
entrance of the
spring equinox
into the sign of
Pisces."(27)
In a letter
written by
Jung to Sigmund
Freud, he said:
"My evenings
are taken up
very largely
with astrology.
I made
horoscopic
calculations in
order to find a
clue to the core
of psychological
truth...I
dare say that we
shall one day
discover in
astrology a good
deal of
knowledge which
has been
intuitively
projected into
the heavens."
(28)
Jung’s family
had occult
linkage on both
sides, from his
paternal
Grandfather’s
Freemasonry
involvement as
Grandmaster of
the Swiss
Lodge(29), and
his maternal
family’s
long-term
involvement with
seances and
ghosts. John
Kerr, author of
A Most Dangerous
Method, comments
that Jung was
heavily involved
for many years
with his mother
and two female
cousins in
hypnotically
induced seances.
Jung eventually
wrote up the
seances as his
medical
dissertation.(30)
Jung acquired
a spirit guide
and guru named
‘Philemon’[who
was described by
Jung as ‘an old
man with the
horns of a
bull...and the
wings of a
fisher’]. Before
being Philemon,
this creature
appeared to Jung
as ‘Elijah’, and
then finally
mutated to ‘Ka’,
an Egyptian
earth-soul that
‘came from
below’.(31)
It may be worth
reflecting upon
why Jung
designated his
Bollingen Tower
as the Shrine of
Philemon.(32)
Carl Jung
himself was the
son of a Swiss
Pastor caught in
an intellectual
faith crisis.
When younger, he
had a
life-changing
dream of a
subterranean
phallic god
which reappeared
"whenever anyone
spoke too
emphatically
about Lord
Jesus."(33) Jung
commented that
"...the
‘man-eater’ in
general was
symbolized by
the phallus, so
that the dark
Lord Jesus, the
Jesuit and the
phallus were
identical."(34)
This "initiation
into the realm
of darkness"(35)
radically shaped
Jung’s
approach to
Jesus: "Lord
Jesus never
became quite
real for me,
never quite
acceptable,
never quite
lovable, for
again and again
I would think of
his underground
counterpart...Lord
Jesus seemed to
me in some ways
a god of
death...Secretly,
his love and
kindness, which
I always heard
praised,
appeared
doubtful to
me..."(36)
The next major
spiritual
breakthrough in
his life was
what Jung
described as a
"blasphemous
vision"(37) of
God dropping his
dung on the
local Cathedral.
This vision,
said Jung, gave
him an intense
"experience of
divine
grace".(38)
3. How
serious is the
Jungian
Reconciliation
of Good and
Evil?
Leanne Payne
says of Dr.
Jeffrey
Satinover that
"like (C.S.)
Lewis, he knows
that we can
never reconcile
(synthesize)
good and evil,
and this
synthesis is the
greatest threat
facing not only
Christendom but
all mankind
today."(39) Dr.
Satinover sees
the temptation
facing our
generation
that"...on a
theological
plane, we
succumb to the
dangerous
fantasy that
Good and Evil
will be reunited
in a higher
oneness."(40)
One of Jung’s
key emphases was
that the "dark
side" of human
nature needed to
be "integrated"
into a single,
overarching
"wholeness" in
order to form a
less strict and
difficult
definition of
goodness.(41)
"For Jung", says
Satinover, "good
and evil evolved
into two equal,
balanced, cosmic
principles that
belong together
in one
overarching
synthesis. This
relativization
of good and evil
by their
reconciliation
is the heart of
the ancient
doctrines of
gnosticism,
which also
located
spirituality,
hence morality,
within man
himself. Hence
‘the union of
opposites’."(42)
Jung believed
that "the
Christ-symbol
lacks wholeness
in the modern
psychological
sense, since it
does not include
the dark side of
things..."(43)
For Jung, it was
regrettable that
Christ in his
goodness lacked
a shadow side,
and God the
Father, who is
the Light,
lacked
darkness.(44) He
spoke of "...an
archetype such
as...the still
pending answer
to the Gnostic
question as to
the origin of
evil, or, to put
it another way,
the
incompleteness
of the Christian
God-image"(45)
Jung sought a
solution to this
dilemma in the
Holy Spirit who
united the split
in the moral
opposites
symbolized by
Christ and
Satan.(46)
"Looked at from
a quaternary
standpoint",
writes Jung,
"the Holy Ghost
is a
reconciliation
of opposites and
hence the answer
to the suffering
in the Godhead
which Christ
personifies."(47)
Thus for Jung,
says John
Dourley, the
Spirit unites
the exclusively
spiritual
reality of
Christ with that
which is
identified with
the devil,
including ‘the
dark world of
nature-bound
man’, the
chthonic side of
nature excluded
by Christianity
from the Christ
image.(48) In a
similar vein,
Jung saw the
alchemical
figure of
Mercurius as a
compensation for
the one-sideness
of the symbol of
Christ.(49) That
is why
Jung
believed that
"It is possible
for a man to
attain totality,
to become whole,
only with the
co-operation of
the spirit of
darkness..."(50)
4. How Much
Influence does
Jungian
Neo-Gnosticism
have on the
Church?
There are key
individuals
promoting the
Jungian gospel
to the Church,
such as Morton
Kelsey, John
Sanford(not John
& Paula Sandford),
Thomas Moore,
Joseph Campbell,
and Bishop John
Spong.
Thomas Moore, a
former Roman
Catholic monk,
is widely
popular with a
new generation
of soul-seekers,
through his
best-seller:
Care of the
Soul. John
Sanford, the son
of the late
Agnes Sanford,
is an Episcopal
Priest and
Jungian analyst,
with several
books promoting
the Jungian way.
Morton Kelsey is
another
Episcopal Priest
who has subtly
woven the
Jungian gospel
through
virtually every
one of his
books, specially
those aimed for
the Charismatic
renewal
constituency.
Satinover
describes Kelsey
as having "made
a career of such
compromise",
noting that
Kelsey has now
proceeded in his
latest book
Sacrament of
Sexuality to
approve of the
normalization of
homosexuality.(51)
Joseph
Campbell, cited
by Satinover as
a disciple of
Jung, is famous
for his public
TV series on
"The Power of
Myth".(52)
Bishop John
Spong, who has
written two
books
(Resurrection:
Myth or Reality
& The Easter
Moment) denying
the physical
resurrection of
Jesus Christ,
gives Joseph
Campbell credit
for shaping his
views on Jesus’
resurrection. "I
was touched by
Campbell’s
ability to seek
the truth of
myths while
refusing to
literalize the
rational
explanation of
those
myths...Campbell
allowed me to
appreciate such
timeless themes
as virgin
births,
incarnations,
physical
resurrections,
and cosmic
ascensions...Slowly,
ever so slowly,
but equally ever
so surely, a
separation began
to occur for me
between the
experience
captured for us
Christians in
the word Easter
and the
interpretation
of that
experience found
in both the
Christian
Scriptures and
the developing
Christian
traditions..."(53)
Few people
have realized
that Bishop
Spong’s
spiritual
grandfather is
none other than
Carl Jung.
"Jung’s
direct and
indirect impact
on mainstream
Christianity -
and thus on
Western
culture," says
Satinover, " has
been
incalculable. It
is no
exaggeration to
say that the
theological
positions of
most mainstream
denominations in
their approach
to pastoral
care, as well as
in their
doctrines and
liturgy - have
become more or
less identical
with Jung’s
psychological/symbolic
theology."(54)
It is not
just the more
‘liberal’
groups, however,
that are
embracing the
Jungian/MBTI
approach. In a
good number of
Evangelical
theological
colleges, the
MBTI is being
imposed upon the
student body as
a basic course
requirement,
despite the
official Jungian
stance that "The
client has the
choice of taking
the MBTI or not.
Even subtle
pressure should
be avoided
(55)."
While in
theological
school, I became
aware of the
strong influence
of Dr. Paul
Tillich on many
modern clergy.
In recently
reading C.G.
Jung & Paul
Tillich [written
by John Dourley,
a Jungian
analyst & Roman
priest from
Ottawa], I came
to realize that
Tillich and Jung
are ‘theological
twins’. In a
tribute given at
a Memorial for
Jung’s death,
Tillich gave to
Jung’s thought
the status of an
ontology because
its depth and
universality
constituted a
‘doctrine of
being’(56) It
turns out that
Tillich is
heavily in debt
in Jung for his
view of God as
the supposed
"Ground of
Being". As well,
both Tillich and
Jung, says
Dourley,
"understand the
self to be that
centering force
within the
psyche which
brings together
the opposites or
polarities,
whose dynamic
interplay makes
up life
itself."(57) As
a Jungian
popularizer,
Tillich saw life
as "made up of
the flow of
energy between
opposing poles
or
opposites."(58)
So many
current
theological
emphases in
today’s church
can be traced
directly back to
Carl Jung. For
example, with
the loss of
confidence in
the Missionary
imperative, many
mainline church
administrators
today sound
remarkably like
Jung when he
said: "What we
from our point
of view call
colonization,
missions to the
heathen, spread
of civilization,
etc, has another
face - the face
of a bird of
prey seeking
with cruel
intentness for
distant quarry -
a face worthy of
a race of
pirates and
highwaymen."(59)
In speaking of
Buddhism and
Christianity,
Jung taught the
now familiar
inter-faith
dialogue line,
that "Both paths
are right."(60)
Jung spoke of
Jesus, Mani,
Buddha, and
Lao-Tse as
‘pillars of the
spirit’, saying
"I could give
none preference
over the
other."(61) The
English
Theologian Don
Cupitt says that
Jung pioneered
the multi-faith
approach now
widespread in
the Church.(62)
For those of
us who wonder
why some
Anglicans are
mistakenly
calling
themselves
"co-creators
with God", the
theological
roots can again
be traced back
to Jung: "...man
is indispensable
for the
completion of
creation; that,
in fact, he
himself is the
2nd creator of
the world, who
alone has given
to the world its
objective
existence..."(63)
In light of our
current
Canadian
controversies
around "Mother
Goddess"
hymnbooks, it is
interesting to
read in the MBTI
source book,
Psychological
Types( Carl
Jung, 1921)
about the
"Gnostic
prototype, viz,
Sophia, an
immensely
significant
symbol for the
Gnosis."(64)
Carl Jung is
indeed the
Grandfather of
much of our
current
theology.
5. What is
the connection
between
‘Archetypes’,
the Unconscious
and the MBTI?
Keirsey and
Bates are strong
MBTI supporters
who have
identified the
link between the
MBTI
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